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MXO2 mini - unstable HDMI to TV while capturing

 
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leeoverstreet
(MXO2 Mini)




Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2016 5:37 pm    Post subject: MXO2 mini - unstable HDMI to TV while capturing Reply with quote

First, a huge THANK YOU to tech support representative Sergio! Via phone / internet he got me from not capturing at all to capturing, and that has set me on my way to archiving tons of old home videos.

I'm using an MXO2 mini with Adobe CC 2015 on a Windows 7 Pro 64 PC with a 4GHz i7, 16GB RAM, nVidia 750 Ti GPU, SSD C: drive, striped RAID0 HDDs for capture. Consumer Sony 32" TV for editing.

Problem(s) at the moment:

1) The HDMI output to my consumer Sony HDTV cuts in and out to black while capturing, or while passing through a signal just before you begin a capture. Playback from the timeline seems to be fine, as are the calibration signals (which I'm not actually using with this current TV). Capture appears to be unaffected, with no dropped frames reported. Any idea why the HDMI out would be stable except while capturing / passing through?

2) For VHS and S-VHS, I'm using a pretty nice JVC HR-S9911U S-VHS VCR, which has several output / processing settings you can use to improve the picture from less than ideal tapes. For a good camcorder tape, I set picture quality to "EDIT" (no processing at all) and turn all other digital processing off. This seems to capture properly. However, when I engage the deck's time base corrector / noise reducer, the image bends badly at the top in the capture window and problem 1 above gets even worse. I like the TBC/NR function (I call it the Magic Green Button) for tapes of lower quality, as it is particularly good at fixing dark color noise. Any ideas why engaging the TBC/NR would make the image HARDER to capture? Is it because the input is set to "consumer" level input?

I really can't wait to get things settled and working so I can start bugging everyone with more interesting workflow / software / codec questions. Smile
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Matrox_Support_Sam
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glad to hear Sergio was of help and got you up and running!

We have not encountered the following issues you are seeing.
#1 - Do the recorded files contain black outs? Or is this just on output monitor during passthrough?
-Have you tried a different HDMI cable, monitor or source input?
-Have you tried a different output signal? ie Analog Component?
-Do you see the same issue using the Matrox AV tools stand-alone capture application?

#2 - Capturing with Consumer level setting on input source is a type of software TBC which cleans up or allows weaker analog signals to passthrough. Not exactly sure why the TBC setting on the VCR would affect the capture. You can try setting the Input setting to Broadcast Qyality and see if this makes a difference. Otherwise, if the signal is passing through correctly with Consumer setting, then no need to adjust the TBC on the VCR.

Hope this helps.
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Sam
Matrox Video Technical Support
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leeoverstreet
(MXO2 Mini)




Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, Sam!

It seems strange to me that the capture is stable, and output when watching / scrubbing from the timeline is stable, but I'll definitely run through all those checks and report back.
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Matrox_Support_Sam
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You are welcome. Let us know your results whenever possible.
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Sam
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leeoverstreet
(MXO2 Mini)




Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 5:50 pm    Post subject: Passthrough depends on tape Reply with quote

Sam,

I experimented a bit in order to answer your questions...

- Do the recorded files contain black outs? Or is this just on output monitor during passthrough?

Recorded files so far look just fine. It only happens to the signal being passed through to the HDTV.

-Have you tried a different HDMI cable, monitor or source input?

Happens on any HDMI cable, and any HDMI input. I only have the one 32" Sony HDTV on which to try it, and all the analog capturing I need to do at the moment is on low-def NTSC tapes.

-Have you tried a different output signal? ie Analog Component?

Yes. The component analog passing through a 480i signal does not drop to black, but instead jitters vertically in varying amounts. Where the HDMI signal goes to black, the component signal jitters worse.

-Do you see the same issue using the Matrox AV tools stand-alone capture application?

Yes. Both it and Premiere's capture behave the same.

- Capturing with Consumer level setting on input source is a type of software TBC which cleans up or allows weaker analog signals to passthrough. Not exactly sure why the TBC setting on the VCR would affect the capture. You can try setting the Input setting to Broadcast Qyality and see if this makes a difference. Otherwise, if the signal is passing through correctly with Consumer setting, then no need to adjust the TBC on the VCR.

Other VHS tapes I tried behaved differently. The first one I was attempting to capture from when I posted my questions was most stable with my VCR's TBC off and input set to consumer, but the next tape worked much better on passthrough with the VCR's TBC on, whether the input was set to pro or consumer. So I guess the passthrough quality is going to be tape by tape? In no case was the passthrough perfect, which is frustrating. At least via analog component, if the signal from the tape is good, I can see the signal throughout, but with just a bit of vertical jitter here and there.

Again, the RECORDED signal looks great as far as I can tell, but the passthrough is often unstable. Is this a result of software correction that happens to the recorded signal that doesn't happen to the passthrough?
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Matrox_Support_Sam
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 12:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not sure, but it is possible the consumer quality setting affects the input not the output. Therefore, the output might be affected without "TBC" setting.
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leeoverstreet
(MXO2 Mini)




Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some other strange behavior when capturing via Premiere Pro:

1) After bringing the PC out of hibernation, and loading Premiere I saw this message: "This project was last used with Mercury Playback Engine GPU Acceleration (CUDA) which is not available on this system. Mercury Playback Engine Software Only will be used." I did a hard reboot, and got no such message on reload.

2) It seems any time the capture process is occurring, and a few seconds of blank tape is encountered (like between scenes when originally recorded on a camcorder) Premiere (or Matrox?) pops up a message that says the tape is copy protected! Capture proceeds normally, however. Toward the end of one hour long unattended capture, the copy protect message appeared AND the passthrough audio was clicking, but the capture was fine and the clicking noises weren't recorded to the file.

So bottom line... Does this odd, kinda lousy passthrough behavior indicate a hardware problem? Before I tackle some big projects, I just want to make sure I have a fully working device.
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Matrox_Support_Sam
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2016 8:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It does not seem to be a hardware defect, and likely due to quality of the analog signal and/or tapes. The consumer quality setting will try its best to clean up the signal of older analog inputs.

As for the hibernation issue, we recommend either turning off hibernate or sleep modes OR as mentioned in our User Guide on page 13:
ftp://ftp.matrox.com/pub/video/doc/Matrox%20MXO2%20Installation%20and%20User%20Guide_8.0.pdf
Before setting your computer to sleep or hibernation mode, make sure that you
first quit any application that is using your Matrox MXO2 hardware.

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Sam
Matrox Video Technical Support
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leeoverstreet
(MXO2 Mini)




Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Thu Jul 28, 2016 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sam... I definitely agree that the old tapes and the signal on them is mostly to blame. Looking on the bright side, when I find settings on the VCR that create the most stable passthrough signal, I know I'm getting about the best I can get off the tapes. With 20-30 year old VHS tapes, I don't expect much more. To be fair, it's doing a remarkable job of correcting it as it captures. Playback and editing is a breeze, so that's all good. We'll see how it does later on 8mm and Hi8.

I may start another topic with questions about file formats and codecs. Or if that would that just end up going to you again I can ask it right here. Very Happy
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Matrox_Support_Sam
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 28, 2016 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the update and glad to hear its working well.

You can start a new post for new inquiries or topics. Likely, i may answer that post as well Very Happy
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Sam
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